Aubade1984: what do you think would be an effective way for MM to make an anti-war documentary?
PinkMoosePearl: define effective
Aubade1984: "demonstrates to people why the bush administration is corrupt and the war is wrong"
Aubade1984: because i don't see how it could be any more effective in doing that
Aubade1984: you can argue that it's exploitative or patronizing or whatever
PinkMoosePearl: do you know what
Aubade1984: but i don't think "we already know all this" is a good argument against it, because a lot of ppl DON'T know all this
PinkMoosePearl: youve done that to those who will listen
PinkMoosePearl: that work is done
PinkMoosePearl: i mean look at the new york times best seller
PinkMoosePearl: half of america thinks this war is nessc. and half of america thinks this war is evil
PinkMoosePearl: and it wont win
PinkMoosePearl: no side will budge
PinkMoosePearl: what will it take for you to be convinced that this war is right
Aubade1984: i don't think it's that simple
Aubade1984: i think it's possible to convince people that the war is wrong because there are good reasons that it is wrong
Aubade1984: i don't think there are any strong arguments in favor of it
PinkMoosePearl: there are good reasons for it
PinkMoosePearl: sadaam hussien is a genocidal maniac
Aubade1984: like?
PinkMoosePearl: see above
PinkMoosePearl: america belives in the concept of liberty
PinkMoosePearl: it is in our economic self interest to mantain free flow of oil
PinkMoosePearl: i mean thats three
Aubade1984: i've heard those reasons before
Aubade1984: for like the last year now
PinkMoosePearl: but they are reasons that are legit
Aubade1984: actually the third one isn't a bad reason
PinkMoosePearl: now we can deconstruct them, except for the third, they have precedent in the jsut war tradition
Aubade1984: the odd thing is that's the one argument i didn't hear anyone make before the war started
PinkMoosePearl: grotius onward
Aubade1984: the second reason is very vague
PinkMoosePearl: ok
Aubade1984: it was used to justify vietnam, after all
PinkMoosePearl: yeah of course
Aubade1984: but i see what you're saying
PinkMoosePearl: and domino is coming back, cf hutcinson and clash of civ. (wrong name)
Aubade1984: that these appear reasonable to half of america
PinkMoosePearl: they are resaonable
PinkMoosePearl: we balance differently then they do though
PinkMoosePearl: x is legit, but y is more legit
PinkMoosePearl: namely
PinkMoosePearl: what pisses me off about moore, mostly
PinkMoosePearl: is that he denies the first half of that equation
Aubade1984: that's a good point
Aubade1984: can you imagine him supporting any president at any time?
Aubade1984: it's that "if we can't have ralph nader, we might as well just say to hell with everything" mentality
PinkMoosePearl: nader is a bully though
Aubade1984: well so is moore
PinkMoosePearl: of course. (do you mind if i post this on my blog ?)
Aubade1984: yeah that's okay
Aubade1984: actually debord was kind of a bully too
Aubade1984: most important public figures seem to have that trait